‎Allow Base Station to connect to 5GHz WiFi | SimpliSafe Support Home
 
J

Wednesday, October 14th, 2020 5:12 PM

Not In Development

1

Allow Base Station to connect to 5GHz WiFi

How about coming out of the last decade and upgrade your system to use 5ghz Wifi rather than the slower 2.4ghz wifi? (which most devices out there use now)

Official Response

Community Admin

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5.2K Messages

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20 Points

11 months ago

Thanks for the suggestion. The decision to lock the Base Station to 2.4GHz was made after considering factors like range, resistance to interference, compatibility, and of course the cost of production. While we can’t rule out that 5GHz will never be implemented, it would require a major hardware change, so for now, this request is NOT IN DEVELOPMENT.

Advocate

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2.2K Messages

3 years ago

Considering their development cycle length, by the time they can handle 5ghz, 10 ghz will be the standard  :-)

2 Messages

2 years ago

2.4ghz is fine, but not for everyone. I, for example, live in a city, so while it's usually great to have the increased propagation of 2.4ghz, for me it means that my neighbors interfere with my signal. I can't rely on it, so I use Ethernet or 5ghz DFS (with zero interference).

Also, even though this is a security company, the devices do not implement WPA3, so the wifi connection has been vulnerable to KRACK since 2017.

I understand, nothing is perfect, but not everyone lives on a one-acre plot and we should be able to tailor our security systems a bit more than what is allowed by a 2.4ghz only solution. I'm not saying that each device needs 2.4ghz, 5ghz, and Power Over Ethernet (POE). But I would certainly pay a fair price to upgrade to a base station with ethernet. I'd probably get a camera or a doorbell if ones with POE were available. A keypad with POE would probably be a worthwhile upgrade so that a constant power flow could keep the screen lit making it easier to know the system status (Off, Home, Away).

Note: This comment was created from a merged conversation originally titled Ethernet and 5g options

3 Messages

Agreed; lack of ethernet or POE capability is the only thing preventing me from choosing SimpliSafe.

6 Messages

1 year ago

5GHz support would be amazing!

Advocate

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677 Messages

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10 Points

11 months ago

5GHz support for the base station provides literally zero benefit over 2.4GHz. (In fact it's arguably worse than the 2.4GHz band since it has a much shorter range.) All of the SS cameras talk directly to SS servers and they do not use the base station as a "proxy" through which data passes.  (You're also not using the base station as a proxy when you access live view on a SS camera.) You don't even need a base station to install and use the video doorbell pro or simplicam - they'll work just fine w/o a base station. (The outdoor camera does talk to the base station over RF but it still uses WiFI to communicate directly with SS servers when sending video streams.)

In fact I'm 99.9% sure that the most data intensive thing your base station ever does is download new firmware which happens 2-4 times a year. (Please correct me if I'm wrong, SS.)

That said, I am 100% in favor of an ethernet option for the base station (in addition to WiFi, not in place of) and I think a POE adapter for the cameras (or even just an option for ethernet for data while still using an AC adapter for power) would be AMAZING. When my friends had Frontpoint a while back I was deeply envious that their cameras had an adapter for connecting with ethernet.

28 Messages

11 months ago

For the cameras, I am 100% supportive of adding 5GHz features.  When an alarm is triggered all cameras begin recording.  Each camera uses up to 3mbits of upload bandwidth for recording.  With quite a few cameras all recording at once, the practical maximum of about 16mbits/sec for 2.4GHz under optimum conditions is quickly used up, and some of the cameras don't get their recordings uploaded.

For the base, it would seem a bit unnecessary since it doesn't really stream or use much bandwidth. 

In our house, older devices and IoT devices are all connected to the 2.4GHz Guest WiFi, with the exception of a very few devices that don't require internet access to function in a closed environment.

Advocate

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677 Messages

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10 Points

10 months ago

With quite a few cameras all recording at once, the practical maximum of about 16mbits/sec for 2.4GHz under optimum conditions is quickly used up, and some of the cameras don't get their recordings uploaded.

The practical maximum of the 2.4GHz band is well beyond 16Mb. More like 16MB if using 802.11n. (See https://www.speedguide.net/faq/what-is-the-actual-real-life-speed-of-wireless-374 for more details.) That's many times over the required bandwidth per camera per SS. (And per just doing the math for a 1080p stream...) There's no reason (other than cost) that SS couldn't put beefier radios/antennae in their cameras if they needed to but I'm not convinced they need to. 

The 2.4GHz band uses longer waves than the 5GHz band. Longer waves a) travel further and b) penetrate building materials and objects better. Not only do you not need the bandwidth of the 5GHz band but you'd have even less range than you do today which could severely limit where you can place outdoor cameras in terms of distance from your router.

I have 3x simplicams, 1x doorbell camera, 1x outdoor camera, 2x new indoor camera and 17x (yes, seventeen!) Wyze cams and they're all connected to the same 2.4GHz network.  (Google WiFi, 3x pucks total, and all the cameras are connected to the guest network.) The Wyze cams? Zero issues. The SS cams? Hit or miss at times even before I added the Wyze Cams. (In fact, I added the Wyze Cams because of the (still ongoing) issues with my SS cams.) Whatever issues the SS cameras are having with missing footage or network issues it's not a bandwidth issue on my Wi-Fi network or my internet connection.

There's something else going on that won't be solved just by switching to the 5GHz band. (Which would, again, introduce other issues.)

28 Messages

@worthing​  so then since you and others are experiencing the same issues with the SS cams but not with other cams, we are to presume it's an inherent issue with the cameras themselves.

Still, I think you may be forgetting that the bandwidth limitations are in the cameras themselves, it may have to do with the wireless protocols and how they mitigate high volume traffic.

Yes, they do use 3mbit per stream and there seems to be an upper limit of 16Mbit that one camera can use.

We are not sure how the test on the camera works under the hood, so it may not be the best method of determining whether we can use the 16Mbit capacity and apply it aggregate across devices to get the maximum number of devices. But I think it is a good measurement with the data we do have.

Your Google wifi system uses multiple base stations which may bring a higher capacity than would a single AP (that is what I do as well). All mine are hardwired with gigabit Ethernet cabling to ensure the most capacity.  My uplink with the fiber company generally speedtests at 400Mbit synchronous. 

But I wouldn't rule it out.  Perhaps a better way is to limit the number of cameras online and run some tests with fewer cameras until we resolve the issue, or not.  Then we will know for sure.

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